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Editing Work Flow Guidance - fourstringstwowheels@gmail.com - 07-13-2025
I am the bass player for a Ukelele group. The leader creates PDF song sheets with chords and lyrics.
I wish to edit these in mobile sheets ( Samsung S10 FE android 15) to create 'gaps' in the existing PDF so I can then manually insert annotations that are my 4 string bass tabs.
Mobile sheets would seem to offce the promsie of this, but I am struggling.
I read a post that said create a blank PDF outside of mobile sheets, I then imported this, copied it to becmome my bass tab song ( I thought) and started pasting in snippets and adding annotations. Opy it faina for the next song etc.. But when I review what I believe were separately edited songs they are all jumbled up / overwritten and i have lost all my work.
I also saw a post that perhaps they had to be in the same set list ?
So created a set-list 'bass tabs' added the uke songs and my blank master and tried again.
When I edited one songs the snippets had been added to all songs.
The results are so confusing I must be approaching this all wrong...
I have read several post and answers and watched some video and realise there is complexity in terms of songs/files/pdf/snippets/annotation and how these exist as objects in the application.
However I am not finding a workflow by play or following what I'd intuitively expect as technical steps.
Please please put me straight on an appropriate workflow and ease my pain.
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Geoff Bacon - 07-14-2025
I'vve never done this but you could try:-
1) Long press song name until checked
2) Edit Song (top of screen)
3) Files Tab
4) + sign
5) Blank Pages
Having added one or more pages, use the up-down arrows to position them in the combined file (if necessary, use the page order field to change the order)
Then annotate/crop these blank pages as required
Geoff
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - itsme - 07-14-2025
What you want to do looks like a lot of work for me (at first sight). Imho you could convert the song sheets to ChordPro with the same effort and get full flexibility to edit . Or, even better, convince your leader to use ChordPro and share both the ChordPro files and the PDFs
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Zubersoft - 07-14-2025
Snippets all share the same underlying file. Embedding annotations will affect any snippet that shares the same underlying PDF. If you go into the song editor, tap the page order field and then duplicate/reorder/remove/add pages/templates as needed, you can tap the three dots at the top right and then save the changes under a new PDF. That will ensure other songs using the same file aren't impacted by any changes you make. If you do this in every snippet, then you are safe to make changes to the files used by the songs without running into the complexities you mentioned. I will be adding an option soon when creating snippets to generate a new PDF instead of using the existing one for users that prefer that workflow.
Mike
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Swiss1000 - 07-15-2025
(07-14-2025, 03:45 PM)Zubersoft Wrote: Snippets all share the same underlying file. Embedding annotations will affect any snippet that shares the same underlying PDF. If you go into the song editor, tap the page order field and then duplicate/reorder/remove/add pages/templates as needed, you can tap the three dots at the top right and then save the changes under a new PDF. That will ensure other songs using the same file aren't impacted by any changes you make. If you do this in every snippet, then you are safe to make changes to the files used by the songs without running into the complexities you mentioned. I will be adding an option soon when creating snippets to generate a new PDF instead of using the existing one for users that prefer that workflow.
Mike
Crating new song "based on.." (model) is the solutions in my opinion.
Convince a song director is probabily a bad way, or a good way to have problems
And if song director use paper, tablet use is sometime
..Guitarist and bass or drum need often suplémentary sheet with tabs or chords grid in addition to the music sheet.
Chord pro is of course the best way or à real music sheet writer like M Score
Nevertheless, it could be really usefull for the musician to create à document needed based on a model.
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - fourstringstwowheels@gmail.com - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 12:52 AM)Swiss1000 Wrote:(07-14-2025, 03:45 PM)Zubersoft Wrote: Snippets all share the same underlying file. Embedding annotations will affect any snippet that shares the same underlying PDF. If you go into the song editor, tap the page order field and then duplicate/reorder/remove/add pages/templates as needed, you can tap the three dots at the top right and then save the changes under a new PDF. That will ensure other songs using the same file aren't impacted by any changes you make. If you do this in every snippet, then you are safe to make changes to the files used by the songs without running into the complexities you mentioned. I will be adding an option soon when creating snippets to generate a new PDF instead of using the existing one for users that prefer that workflow.
Mike
Crating new song "based on.." (model) is the solutions in my opinion.
Convince a song director is probabily a bad way, or a good way to have problems
And if song director use paper, tablet use is sometime
Guitarist and bass or drum need often suplémentary sheet with tabs or chords grid in addition to the music sheet.
Chord pro is of course the best way or à real music sheet writer like M Score
Nevertheless, it could be really usefull for the musician to create à document needed based on a model.
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - fourstringstwowheels@gmail.com - 07-15-2025
Hi Geoff,
first can I say thank you for such a prompt reply. I did try and follow your worflow but cropping down lopks like it would create lots of separate pages which is not what I need at all. The annotation added bass tab must sit straight after the chord/lyric line i.e. be interspersed on every page.
KR
4S2W
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - fourstringstwowheels@gmail.com - 07-15-2025
Thank you Zubersoft for your advice..
I have just tried to follwo your workflow:
"in the song editor, tap the page order field and then duplicate/reorder/remove/add pages/templates as needed, you can tap the three dots at the top right and then save the changes under a new PDF. "
I gave it a new name and then cannot find that song in te app.. Aha I thought I need to import it as a song.. after navigating the filesystem I found the local file but the app stated ignoring duplicate !!
after further trial and error I had to set "duplicate file behaviour - create new song" before it would import.. that is not intuitive if I have already saved as new pdf..
At which stage am I created a separate standalone song, that is safe to put time into to annotate without affecting any others and won't be overwritten by my next bass tab writing ?
KR
4S2W
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Swiss1000 - 07-15-2025
It is an option my drumer speak about : with pedal switch, imagine to display or remove notes of the active musicscore ?
Sometime, musicians have notes to remember, they don't need to display it all the time.
?
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - e.k. - 07-16-2025
(07-15-2025, 10:38 PM)Swiss1000 Wrote: It is an option my drumer speak about : with pedal switch, imagine to display or remove notes of the active musicscore ?
Sometime, musicians have notes to remember, they don't need to display it all the time.
IMHO there is no need for an additional option/feature like this.
If you don´t need your notes, just ignore it. Or, delete it (in preparation of rehearsals or stage or whatever).
Further, there is an option "show notes when loaded", check/uncheck it, as needed.
e.k.
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Swiss1000 - 07-16-2025
(07-16-2025, 12:12 AM)e.k. Wrote:(07-15-2025, 10:38 PM)Swiss1000 Wrote: It is an option my drumer speak about : with pedal switch, imagine to display or remove notes of the active musicscore ?
Sometime, musicians have notes to remember, they don't need to display it all the time.
IMHO there is no need for an additional option/feature like this.
If you don´t need your notes, just ignore it. Or, delete it (in preparation of rehearsals or stage or whatever).
Further, there is an option "show notes when loaded", check/uncheck it, as needed.
e.k.
Well, it's perhaps worth thinking about.
So far, we each have a main score, alongside a page for the lyrics, and he adds a page for drum specifics (intro, outro, rhythm type, etc.). He uses a drum switch attached to the snare drum that moves forward and backward. He would prefer to temporarily display annotations. He did this with the setlist and song lyrics display, but we need them too.
It might be cool to temporarily display annotations transparently and be able to remove them...
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - BRX - 07-16-2025
@Swiss1000
I know you consider that "geek stuff". But IMHO you don't understand and use the existing functions of MS enough and should read the manual just to see what you can do.
You can put annotations in different layers and select them so that you display different annotations for different people and hide them completely too if wanted.
You (or your drummer) just have to learn to use MS better.
(And you can't hide or unhide or display selected annotations with the "paper route")
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Swiss1000 - 07-16-2025
(07-16-2025, 01:21 AM)BRX Wrote: @Swiss1000
I know you consider that "geek stuff". But IMHO you don't understand and use the existing functions of MS enough and should read the manual just to see what you can do.
You can put annotations in different layers and select them so that you display different annotations for different people and hide them completely too if wanted.
You (or your drummer) just have to learn to use MS better.
(And you can't hide or unhide or display selected annotations with the "paper route")
We tried using layers. It's a complex concept for most people.
People want a simple solution.
The reality isn't what we'd like it to be. And there's growing resistance to complex digitalization.
Danielle, above, explains very well that young people aren't massively turning to tablets.
Personally, I don't need layers; in my workflow, a single layer is used to write a sort of Post-It note, which will be deleted and replaced with a modification to the sheet music, and redistributed.
But I understand the drummer's idea: he wants to find personal annotations, without always displaying them.
There is no easy way to do this rapidly yet.
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - BRX - 07-16-2025
Well, if you're talking about youth and making things simpler for them (and oldies) I think it's the wrong approach. As wrong as the approach followed in schools in my country for the last 30 years which was and is to make the curriculum easier and easier so no kid feels left behind instead of making the smarter or teach them better and reward achievements instead of just muddling through and "feeling good". It's a joke what kids nowadays are taught today and leaves us with a mess. OK, stopping the rant here. (Or almost: That there aren't used more tablets in orchestras has probably lots to do with lack of availability and opportunity and of course costs for a tablet. My educated guess is, that very rarely anyone switches back to paper after he began using digital sheets with MS, forScore and so on).
But what I'm saying is: Make the user smarter, don't dumb down the application.
And for your drummer: Either he sticks to the "paper route" and keeps to sheets of paper, one with annotations, one without, or he tries to use MS properly. (Though he could scan his 2 papersheets as two pages of one song and switch back and forth as needed in MS).
RE: Editing Work Flow Guidance - Zubersoft - 07-16-2025
(07-15-2025, 05:45 PM)fourstringstwowheels@gmail.com Wrote: Thank you Zubersoft for your advice..
I have just tried to follwo your workflow:
"in the song editor, tap the page order field and then duplicate/reorder/remove/add pages/templates as needed, you can tap the three dots at the top right and then save the changes under a new PDF. "
I gave it a new name and then cannot find that song in te app.. Aha I thought I need to import it as a song.. after navigating the filesystem I found the local file but the app stated ignoring duplicate !!
after further trial and error I had to set "duplicate file behaviour - create new song" before it would import.. that is not intuitive if I have already saved as new pdf..
At which stage am I created a separate standalone song, that is safe to put time into to annotate without affecting any others and won't be overwritten by my next bass tab writing ?
KR
4S2W
You said you could not find the new song - what do you mean by that? If you selected the option to save as a new PDF, it should have asked for the new filename, then when you return to the song editor, you should see that the file is now listed under the name you provided. The existing song is edited to use that new file, so save the changes, then load the song you just edited and it should display the changes you made. If you are saying you encounter an error of some kind and the renamed PDF can't be loaded, let me know.
Mike