[droydmaester]

Face gestures on Windows are much more stable and usable- thanks! I've still had an odd crash or two, but most consistently, it seems to be the first time a score is viewed/face gestures activate, if it's going to crash, it will do it then and exit. Then on the second try, it seems to work.

Having used face gestures a bit, I think a couple of settings would greatly enhance the usability:

1. A "quick action" toggle to turn them on or off. See this poor mspaint mock up:
 

This could possibly be placed in the bottom toolbar of the overlay, but it adds an extra step or two to bring this up and hide it again, and would be so convenient in the quick action box. Maybe there could be a toggle to turn this option off or on (or customize it- I would much more rarely use the audio player feature, for example, so I'd be glad to swap those options out if it needed to be limited to 5 options (instead of 9 possible option slots).

2. In the program options > Face gestures panel, once gestures are toggled on, an additional toggle to make them only active in performance mode.

As an organist (a user base for whom face gestures are almost a necessity in order to play from a device instead of paper, since there's not a good way to add a bluetooth pedal, and our hands and feet are already occupied, and the music rack is often further away than on a piano, making manual turns difficult), it's not uncommon to spend a great deal of practice time on a single page or two, marking it up, learning the piece, registering, etc., and it would be nice (and battery-saving) to not have the camera on when face gestures are not needed during that time, but have them automatically activate when performance mode begins (vs. regular viewing mode).

3. In reading several posts/comments about the development of the face gestures feature, I saw mentioned that there would be touch actions to turn gestures on or off. I assume this would mean they could be activated by a smart button/pedal/keypress; however, I've gone through all the options I can think of and I don't see a touch action (either of pedal/button style or the screen zone actions) to turn face gestures on or off. This could be helpful, too; though a quick/clear toggle as in #1 would still be my preference since there's no doubt about what I'm trying to do.

As an organist, there would be lots of time even in performance mode (such as playing a hymn or other strophic/versified piece) where you'd be on a single page for several minutes and not need the face gestures, but then moving to the next piece you would. The quick action box is convenient, but perhaps even cooler would be the ability to have a smart button that could issue a series of commands in sequence, i.e. to turn on face gestures and issue other commands, such as:

4. Touch (button) action to reset the current view (of current piece or portion of setlist). For example, toward the end of the setlist, I have a piece that's 6-7 pages. I typically prefer having two pages side-by-side in landscape mode, and to turn pages in alternating mode. However, depending on what comes before in the set list, the first page of this multi-page piece can end up on the right side, necessitating an extra page turn early on.

Inserting a blank page doesn't help, as in this case, despite putting it first in the setlist order, the blank page gets placed after the first page of the multi-page piece in alternating turn mode.

I know you can change the setting to make pieces separately, which is a work around for now, but in this same set list (and frequently), I have another piece that's a multi-page file that is paired with a verse/refrain which is a single page that gets seamlessly inserted into/added on to the other piece, so turning into/out of this extra page needs this feature on. These verses are different per liturgy, so it makes sense to have them as (hundreds of) separate files rather than insert the file into the other piece each time (and then deleting it later). Hopefully this process description makes sense. I can create a little video if it's helpful.

With that in mind, what I think would be helpful is to have an option added on to the per-piece display mode (i.e. single/two page), you can also choose the page turn style for that piece and/or choose to split the view for that piece (so that the first page of that piece is treated as separate/new view and begins on the left side in 2-page mode).

Once that was selected, and you saw the view how you liked it, being able to assign the current view/page turn mode as an action on a smart button would be super helpful. This way, in quick succession, you could go from a single page piece, face gestures off, etc. and then using a smart button on the next piece get it set up with the correct view, face gestures (or autoscrolling and all the other options you currently support) with one touch. It's not uncommon for an organist to have to make this kind of transition with just seconds to spare, plus any other adjustments with stops, etc. on the instrument.

Thanks for your consideration and all the great work you've done!

[Zubersoft]

Thanks for sharing your experiences and feedback. Responses below:

1) Is this really necessary given that I already support a touch and pedal action to do this?

2) I'm okay with adding this, although, once again, I'm not sure it's necessary given that you can already assign a touch or pedal action to turn them on or off. What I'm missing at the moment is a status indicator so users know when it's active - adding that is on my list of things to do.

3) This is a bug - I didn't update the list of touch and pedal actions to match what is on Android/iOS. I'll get this fixed.

4) It sounds like the scenario you are unhappy with is if you put a blank page first, that blank page could end up on the right side, with the next page on the left side which you don't want. The only way to prevent this is the "separate songs in two page mode" setting. I don't want to have to add another "per-song" type setting to indicate whether it should be displayed separately from other songs, or force it's first page to be on the left, as that is just a can of worms with how the logic works given all the different page turn modes, display modes (including book mode), etc. I think the current setting to separate songs in two page mode completely covers this, and I'd like to hear more about why it is insufficient for what you are wanting.

Mike

[droydmaester]

Thanks, Mike. With regards to #1–3, if I'm reading correctly, there should be a touch action to turn these on or off, but there is not currently in the Windows version because the touch action isn't included in the list of available options? Once this appears in the list, would it already be possible to add the turning on/off of face gestures via a smart button?

2. The status indicator would be helpful. Assuming that it might go in one of the two places mocked up (overlay or quick action box), then making it clickable as a toggle would be really great, and seems to me to be intuitive. To me, the quick action box seems the more logical place so that the indicator/setting would be visible quickly in performance mode without having to turn it off.


with indicator in either QA box or overlay; toggled off


with indicator in either QA box or overlay; toggled on. If setting to tie face gestures to performance mode were added, then toggling performance mode on would turn on face gestures as well.

As it currently stands, there are two major benefits I see to adding this functionality:
  - 1) battery saving by not using the camera in rehearsal mode (learning, marking up the piece, remaining on a particular page for a long period of time)
  - 2) stability. While markedly more stable than in my previous email to you, it still crashes somewhat frequently. I've noticed that if face gestures remain on for a while without detecting a page turn, they seem to stop watching for gestures at all (though the camera remains on as evidenced by a camera on LED on my device). Additionally, when face gestures are on, touching the screen (edges to turn pages or access features on the overlay) seems more likely to trigger whatever is causing the app to crash. (Not always, but it's much more likely to crash after touching the screen when face gestures are on.)


Perhaps long-pressing the indicator could take you to the face gesture settings page.

Regarding #4, there was something happening with a particular piece where I had a particular page turn mode set for that piece (i.e. 2 page turn) and it was preceded by an odd number of pages in the set list before it. Then, the first page would end up on the right side, and when turning two pages, then the next page would end up on the right (backwards reading order). I was able to figure out a work-around in the last few services I played.

I will experiment further and if this is still something I'd like to suggest, I'll start a new topic with some more detail and experience under my belt. Thanks again!

Thanks for sharing your experiences and feedback. Responses below:

1) Is this really necessary given that I already support a touch and pedal action to do this?

2) I'm okay with adding this, although, once again, I'm not sure it's necessary given that you can already assign a touch or pedal action to turn them on or off. What I'm missing at the moment is a status indicator so users know when it's active - adding that is on my list of things to do.

3) This is a bug - I didn't update the list of touch and pedal actions to match what is on Android/iOS. I'll get this fixed.

4) It sounds like the scenario you are unhappy with is if you put a blank page first, that blank page could end up on the right side, with the next page on the left side which you don't want. The only way to prevent this is the "separate songs in two page mode" setting. I don't want to have to add another "per-song" type setting to indicate whether it should be displayed separately from other songs, or force it's first page to be on the left, as that is just a can of worms with how the logic works given all the different page turn modes, display modes (including book mode), etc. I think the current setting to separate songs in two page mode completely covers this, and I'd like to hear more about why it is insufficient for what you are wanting.

Mike

[Zubersoft]

If you get a chance, please test this again with version 3.8.31 as you should see the touch action now, and you can long press the right icon in the quick action box to assign it to "Enable/disable face gestures" if that is your preference. The long press for that icon reassigns the action, so I can't use it to take you to the settings page. Once I add more configuration for the quick action box, then more options will be available for things like this.

Mike